Tuesday Loss Links

by Wes Cox on Nov 27, 2007 9:59 AM CST in News Comment 6 comments

At no point last night did I really think the Mavs were going win that game. That's unusual.

Eddie Sefko told it like it is in his game recap.

The Mavs were lazy on offense, settling for too many jumpers. They were 3-of-21 from 3-point range. They shot 39 percent for the game and just 22-of-62 (35.5 percent) in the last three quarters. A big first quarter by Dirk Nowitzki masked problems that became obvious later in the game.

Dallas' sluggish offense wasn't helped by the fact it couldn't stop the Wizards.

Having Josh Howard play reduced minutes because of foul trouble didn't help.

"I think if I had been in the third quarter, the whole aspect of the game would have changed," said Howard, the Mavs' leading scorer this season. "That's just something... I have to work on. And I think the refs need to cut me a break because I don't think I'm fouling that much."

I think Avery kind of blew this one.

What was the worst case scenario of leaving Josh in the game? Him fouling out and having to sit on the bench. I don't really see how the solution is to put Howard on the bench -- the exact same thing you are trying to prevent. There was no point in saving Howard for the 4th when the game would be over. Dallas needed him on the court in the third. Badly.

It was like a baseball manager refusing to use his closer before the ninth inning.

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When asked about his fine, Avery started talking about his upcoming book.

I don't know if he was just trying to dodge the question, but it was really confusing.

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Devean George has been cleared for full practice.

Eddie Jones is about a week away.

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Art Garcia's notables.

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Mark Cuban is behind some sort eBay-ish Facebook application and is going to be selling "the only existing Rodman Jerseys from his 11 days on the Mavs" on it.

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This Day in Mavs History

2002 Michael Finley had 42 points, the 41st time a Mavs player had 40+ points and the only time Finley had 40+ points with Dallas.

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Josh on the bench

You're right, "It was like a baseball manager refusing to use his closer before the ninth inning."

That's exactly what it is.

As for George and Jones, where do they fall in the rotation?

If we're all healthy, Terry is 6th, Stack is 7th, Bass is 8th, so are they ahead of Hassell coming in at 9 and 10? How much impact are you expecting from either or combined?

I know it's not as if the lineup is set in stone, and it would likely change in the playoffs based on matchups, I'm just curious if this is how the Mavs are viewing it.

"I could have knocked him out in the third round but I wanted to do it slowly, so he would remember this night for a long time." - Mike Tyson

by Chase Irwin on Nov 27, 2007 12:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Totally agree on Josh

I posted the same thoughts at DM.com.

I know that most coaches make the same move in that situation, but over the last few season a few coaches have begun thinking outside the box on foul trouble and when to take guys out.

Tonight was a perfect example of why. Josh sat out the entire third quarter, basically, and that's when we essentially lost the game. By the time Josh got back in we'd built a hole that we never recovered from.

And, Josh ended the game with those 4 fouls. He never picked up another one. I heard Jeff Van Gundy refer to it as "a coach fouling a player out by sitting him", and I completely agree with that philosophy.

by jthig32 on Nov 27, 2007 1:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Common strategy.

The idea behind sitting a player in foul trouble is a common strategy because it is most often effective in saving a player for later minutes. Most coaches will make that call 10 times out of 10 because it leaves the player vulnerable if you play him with heavy fouls. If a defender gets 4-5 fouls, teams will often attack at the player since he will have a tendency to play less aggressive to remain in the game.

I would also be willing to bet that another motivation behind this move is that with a supposedly talented team like the Mavs, a coach should have a bench player(s) that can step in and give you some production on at least one end of the floor for the starter in foul trouble - at least keep the game from getting out of hand. Of that, the players are culpable.

Even the most well-conceived decisions can make a coach look foolish if the players don't execute. Add to that Caron Butler playing out of his mind (even with a defender on him), and you earn an L. I don't know that I would put this one at Avery's feet.

by DitchThePlaybook on Nov 27, 2007 6:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I understand the idea

And I have no problem with Josh being taken out at the time of the foul. But as things are slipping away at the 6 minutes mark of the third quarter, or so, you have to get Josh back in. Period.

If you save your player for the fourth, the game may already be over. Avery taking Josh out for the entire third was the equivalent of fouling out. There was no difference.

Just because coaches have always done it that way doesn't make it a good idea.

by jthig32 on Nov 27, 2007 9:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

True Hoop

kind of wrote about about this in April, and I was finall able to find the post this morning.

by Wes Cox on Nov 28, 2007 9:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I thought I remembered reading that article.....

And I understand the logic, but odds say it's better strategy to have the player in the final minutes vs. early minutes, as the article even mentions. It's also in reference to removing a player early with 2 fouls which is different than a player with 4 fouls early in the 3rd.

As a matter of fact, on ESPN radio pregame tonight, Chuck Cooperstein interviewed Avery, and basically asked him the same question. I'll see if I can find a link to the audio, but he specifically mentioned Josh being unable to play well in foul trouble as a reason he kept him out.

I love me some J-Ho, but I tend to agree with the practice of reserving players for the end of the game. In the NBA, and specifically with the Mavs, you're never out of the game, even going into the 4th with a 13 pt. deficit.

by DitchThePlaybook on Nov 28, 2007 8:39 PM CST reply actions 0 recs