Weekend Open Thread

by Toddy on May 24, 2008 3:00 PM CDT Comment 43 comments

With all the trade discussion going on, something that hasn’t been given too much attention here is who we should go after on the FA market this summer with our MLE and VET min contracts. Here is a list of potential swingmen we could go after to replace George and Jones. Jones has an option this year, no word yet (that I know of) that he will pick that up. Remember we have Reyshawn Terry that we could bring back over from Europe.

Tony Allen
James Posey
Daniel Gibson
Juan Dixon
Mickael Petrius
Kirk Snyder
Bonzi Wells
Antoine Wright
Maurice Evans
Gordan Giricek
Brent Barry
CJ Miles
Roger Mason

Who should we pick up? Should we go ahead and just keep George and Jones? These are only some swingmen that are available of course, but this is assuming that we can pick up Diop or maybe Kurt Thomas or a Francisco Elson, say at 3-4 mil p/ year. Does someone else have a list of Big's that we can realistically go after this summer?

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To start things off, much has been suggested around these parts that the NBA is rigged. From Stern not liking Mark, and him supposedly swaying the calls in the Finals, to the NBA as a whole not liking Dallas because it hasn’t really had (up until we got Kidd that is) a marketable superstar. After watching the Spurs blow a 20 point league the other night, could David Stern be throwing his weight around to make sure a Celtics-Lakers Finals becomes a reality this season?

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Boston at Detroit - today 7:30 CST, ABC

For those of you who are even still watching the NBA at this point, there has been some surprisingly decent basketball out East. The Celtics just lost their first game at home in the playoffs this last week, with them finding it hard to score outside of their big three. They head back to Detroit today, and though Boston has not won on the road this postseason, Detroit has been known to take a game or two off in a series.

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Lakers at San Antonio - Tomorrow 7:30 CST, TNT

I am so confused in watching the Lakers-Spurs series. My dis-like and hatred for both teams has my mind swirling around as too who I should pull for. Needless to say, Lakers have looked really good, and San Antonio has looked like, well, we did in the first round... Old, a step behind, giving up leads, and allowing the opposing teams star take over the game.

Stackhouse went on the Herd this week, and displayed his hatred for the Spurs and calls them out as being some of the biggest "cry-babies" in the league. Specifically pointing out Tim Duncan.

He of course is pulling for the Lakers, says that Kobe is pretty "arrogant" but he thinks that SA will find a way to win the series. This interview was done before lasts nights game.

You can listen to the Podcast on ESPN if you have insider on the Mavs team page, I couldn’t link it for whatever reason.

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CJ Miles

because he has my name.

Him and Wright would be an athletic duo.

"We will look back in 20 years, and say that Clayton Kershaw was one of the best pitchers of all time" - me

by miles on May 24, 2008 3:52 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Get Bonzi

Bonzi Wells would be an upgrade….signing Diop would be a great move…still we need to fill that shooting guard spot…would the numbers match Terry for Artest…...I really like the idea of trading Stackhouse & Howard for Zach Randolph …I still think we need to some how get a younger point guard maybe trading for a draft pick… I can see it now Kidd at the point Artest at the 2 Randolph at the 3 Dirk at the 4 and the tandem of Diop and Damp at the 5 with Bonzi Wells coming off the bench.

by aaronp on May 24, 2008 6:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

no

"We will look back in 20 years, and say that Clayton Kershaw was one of the best pitchers of all time" - me

by miles on May 24, 2008 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like your answer, a clear, simple no.

I once asked this a in a different thread. Those who want Artest and Melo, please explain why. I still haven’t gotten an answer.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes you have

at least on Melo. From me.

The 40 trumps all!!!

by thedirkatron on May 25, 2008 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Artest yes, Melo hell to the no

Artest is a great defender, and one of our biggest problems has been defending superstars – Kobe, Dwyane, CP3 just to name a few. He would also contribute as a scoring swingman; I always thought he was underrated offensively.

Melo doesn’t play defense and, fairly or not, has come across as selfish to me ever since he threw a hissy fit over lack of playing time in the Olympics his rookie year. The same Olympic team, I might add, that didn’t win the gold for the first time since NBA players were allowed. Maybe if players like Melo (a rookie!!!) weren’t so concerned about personal glory things might’ve been different.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 25, 2008 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

THE BRAWL.

Game set match. I win this discussion.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Meh.

Jason Kidd beat his wife. Why don’t people get mad about that?

... I’m not defending Artest’s behavior in the past, but he hasn’t gotten into real trouble since then. I’d take him in a heartbeat if the price was right.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 25, 2008 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kidd said that his wife was abusing HIM, so this thing is very unclear.

We know what Artest has done. I know Melo can’t or doesn’t play defense, I don’t which it is, but if we have a great defender at SG, that would solve our defensive problems.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 26, 2008 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

allow me to elaborate

because I realize the Kidd reference seemed out of the blue.

Because what Artest did was on a national stage, people remember him for it and think it the worst thing a professional athlete could do. In reality, it isn’t that unbelievable, and to me isn’t any worse than off the court legal problems. He was provoked by a fan, and though his behavior was reprehensible, it is a clear reason that fans are not allowed to throw things onto the court.

Kidd admitted to an act of domestic violence (and his wife accused him of more during their recent divorce squabbles). Because it’s off the court, no one would think twice about having him on their team.

If Artest had done this repeatedly..? Sure, I would say no. But just because his offense was seen by every basketball fan in the world doesn’t mean he’s a perpetual trouble-maker, anymore than Kidd’s incident means he’s a constant risk to be arrested and miss games.

So, yeah, I’d take Artest on my team. He reacted like a lot of people with anger issues might have in the same situation.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 25, 2008 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"He reacted like a lot of people with anger issues might have in the same situation."

He has anger issues that when provoked again, he may get himself suspended. Who would be a bigger distraction Artest or Melo. The answer is Melo.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 26, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm

Randolph? No. He’s got way more problems than Howard, sucks at D, and is chubby. Terry for Artest would be great, but I doubt Sacto would go for it. Out of the free agents I like Diop, of course, and Miles, Wright, or Pietrus.

by mffeva on May 24, 2008 8:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

yes

"We will look back in 20 years, and say that Clayton Kershaw was one of the best pitchers of all time" - me

by miles on May 24, 2008 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just saw this...

The Knicks are open to trading away their draft pick this year AND a big contract to clear for LBJ next summer.

Still, even with this pick (the 6th I think), I dont think I would be open to taking on one of those two guys for Howard. I dont follow draft stuff too much except who the top 3 guys are usually, but I still doubt a deal like this would make us a contender this year.

by Toddy on May 24, 2008 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What would

you get from the Knicks’ pick at six though?

by jonthefon on May 24, 2008 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You just saw this.

I said something about this a couple of days ago.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

a young point guard

I like Kidd but the Mavs know that they traded away there future they need to save some face and immulate what they did when they traded Jamison for DH….You can win now and still build for the future look at the Pistons & Spurs…The Mavs could get Eric Gordon O.J Mayo through trading in the draft maybe even working a deal for Derrick Rose that solves are PG for the future. Now Mavs need to fill that shooting gaurd spot- back up center and some younger depth on the bench.

kiddisaster

by aaronp on May 25, 2008 12:28 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

You can't win now and build for the future

How can you win now by trading for a rookie point guard? I can’t remember a rookie PG aside from Magic Johnson, leading his team to winning in the NBA (whatever you mean by “winning”) Plus, trading for a top pick is impossible for we don’t have the pieces for a deal that will bring Rose or Mayo or Gordon. Even Carmelo Anthony is expendable for a #1 pick! And sir, Pistons and Spurs have consistency and winning culture as trademarks. I don’t think they built for their future while winning. They were the worst team before being awarded by the #1 pick which turned out to be Timmy D. If we go for a young PG, it’s like judging the Kidd Trade a failure without the benefit of a training camp and a new coach.

by PinoyMFFL on May 25, 2008 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Spurs and Pistons have basically had the same starting lineup for the past 5 years.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good luck, working out a deal for Rose.

With those two guards, I don’t like Mayo at all. I think he is completely overrated and will be nothing more than a good point guard and a low seeded playoff team. I like Gordon, but when I think of him, I think of Jason Terry.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 1:16 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Charles Barkley = Ron Burgundy

Not sure if this was posted elsewhere on here, but it’s a youtube video of Chuck Barkley getting punked by EJ and Kenny. It’s funny. Click on it.

The 40 trumps all!!!

by thedirkatron on May 25, 2008 2:57 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Comedy Gold.

I like Barkely. He tells it like it is.

by coolaid on May 26, 2008 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So Terry & Kidd???

So an old point guard who will have been in the league 14 years this coming season and a shoot first point guard at the 2 is who you want as your back court and the future of your team…the mavs are in decline especially going at this rate its inevitable that unless they do something they will be forced to rebuild you might be right about winning now and rebuilding for the future…but as we know one big move being creative with the draft and picking up some nice players in FA could be key in a positive turning point for a team look at the Lakers pick up Pau its a turning point for the positive.. a few years ago Rasheed to the Pistons… turning point with the spurs they draft well and always pick up good free agents Tony Parker was picked 28 in 2001 and Manu was picked 57th along with getting steals in FA ( Micheal Finley) not to mention players want to play for these teams so there always gonna get the good FA…..Why cant the Mavs use players like Howard, Terry, and Stack to get some new players it hasnt worked for the mavs thus far and we know Dirk isnt going anywhere…and Kidd well Cuban wont admitt to being wrong about that deal…So why not trying seeing what you can get for Howard, Terry and Stack and get some younger players or players that just fill our needs better???

kiddisaster

by aaronp on May 25, 2008 2:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

omg TEXT...

Cuban isn’t going to blow it up until Kidd’s had a full training camp with the team (and Carlisle).

Obviously, the best course of action – and one which every GM in the history of forever has wanted to do – would be to try and rebuild for the future while putting the best possible product on the court with Dirk now. Is this feasible? Not if you go out and try to get a high draft pick – you can’t get a high pick without giving up something of value, and it’s a gamble at best that a draft pick will be able to step in and contribute.

I think the best bet is to see what the team can do with the MLE, try to pick up a vet on the cheap who wants to play with Kidd and Dirk, and hopefully buy a late first rounder. I’d be shocked if Reyshawn isn’t playing in some capacity next season as well. But picking up an impact FA simply isn’t going to happen this summer: The cap flexibility just isn’t there.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 25, 2008 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would almost

Bet money that 2 out of these 3 players Howard, Terry and Stack will be traded in the summer. It would be a shame if the only things the Mavs do is pick up a MLE player and think they are going to compete if they say otherwise its just talk….

kiddisaster

by aaronp on May 25, 2008 3:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Perhaps

Terry or Howard, but I don’t see Stackhouse going anywhere except to match salaries.. it’s not like anyone’s bending over backwards to get him.

Josh is tough to trade right now, because his value’s at a low with his 2nd half performance + marijuana stuff, and his contract extension (I don’t think) kicks in yet, so his salary is hard to trade for a player of any value.

Terry is the best pure shooter this team has, and he’s probably the most vocal leader.

I’m just not seeing it, but Cuban’s always looking to surprise.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 25, 2008 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

We have to trade people, because this team hasn't won.

If this team couldn’t win this year, what makes you think there going to win next year. We got killed by all the good teams, except for Phoenix and New Orleans late in the regular season.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 25, 2008 4:14 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Who said something about Kidd and Terry for the future?

We are not rebuilding. We are trying to be in the best shape possible for the next 2 years because it is the window to that championship. It’s ridiculous to put Kidd and Terry and Future in the same sentence. Kidd was obtained to maximize Dirk’s prime. DH was traded because his prime and Dirk’s wouldn’t meet. Management decided that its time to win now. I think the first way to surround KIDDIRK with quality players is to pick-up Diop to solidify the center position. Then try to listen for offers for Howard and Terry (as there was 15 possible trade scenarios with Josh by DMN’s Eddie Sefko) Pietrus and Evans sounds good to me as 2/3 players with good leaping ability that may complement Kidd’s passing ability.

If the Kidd trade fails, the future is not so dark as Kidd’s huge expiring contact in 2009-2010 (not sure) can be used as bait. His salary is $19,728,000 and ranks sixth in top salaries according to hoopshype. Remember that Brown’s expiring contract of about 9mil. was able to lure Pau Gasol. Imagine the offers that we would get for that contract especially now that teams are preparing for that hyped 2010 FA class. At that point you could think of rebuilding, unlike trading for young players and rookies that won’t take advantage of Dirk’s prime.

by PinoyMFFL on May 25, 2008 5:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Zach Randolph?

HELL NO.

As for the FA swingmen list… I’ve said all along that Cuban needs to split the MLE for between Diop and Pietrus… Just get more athletic with that exception.

Then buy a late first rounder and draft Mario Chalmers as a defensive minded, athletic PG…

by N41D on May 25, 2008 11:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

+1

except with us only having about 5 mil for the MLE, I dont think we would be able to pick up both Diop and Pietrus.

by Toddy on May 25, 2008 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I really don't see Pietrus drawing much interest...

Maybe I’m wrong, but I can’t see someone giving him the full MLE…

But yeah, my scenario is assuming the costs work out in our favor…

Not sure I could see Diop drawing more than a portion of the MLE from somebody, either…

by N41D on May 26, 2008 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

but if not pietrus, we need to get some one like him. Diop was getting 4 mil per year, I cant imagine him going much less than that… which then puts us in a bind for going after someone else.

by Toddy on May 26, 2008 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nah, Diop made just over 2 mil this year...

And it seemed like he took a step back this year from where he was production-wise a season ago… I’d be SHOCKED if he made more than that…

Let’s say he gets 2.5 mil… We’ve still got about 2.8 to go use on somebody else, and I’d think that’s probably close to what it’d take to snag Pietrus.

by N41D on May 26, 2008 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

you're right

I dont know why I thought he was getting around 4 mil a year… Well that makes it somewhat easier to sign diop for about the same, and then try and bring in someone else like Pietrus or Wright

by Toddy on May 26, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Pick up

Gerald Green or Maurice Evans. Diop is a no-brainer, he said he wants to go back to Dallas and we have problems now that the West is beefing up with big men. If JHO-for-JO deal doesn’t materialize despite the rumors, Diop SHOULD be signed with the MLE along with either Green or Maurice Evans maybe. Green is a high-flyer that would be a nice running mate with kidd, so as Evans. Only problem is Green is thought of as not a good locker room guy but hey, who knows what Carlisle can do with the kid? I dont think Pietrus would be realistic, he would want more money than we could offer but the thought of him sounds good.

by PinoyMFFL on May 26, 2008 4:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

The following actions would give us over 9.5 million dollar less salary then last year.

Sign Josh Smith for 15 million per year.
Trade Howard, Stackhouse, and Jones for Redd. Have Stackhouse get bought out and resign him.
Trade Terry and Dampier for Jermaine O’Neal and Marquis Daniels, only works on realgm.com with Jones, so wouldn’t have to add much salary.
Sign Diop for 4 million.
Resign Barea for 1 million.
Resign Howard for 1.5 million.
Buy low first round draft pick and select Brandon Rush.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 27, 2008 5:46 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

That would be good

I wouldnt be mad if that happened at all…I like that scenario…I actually would be thrilled if that happened…it would suck if JO or Kidd got hurt for an extended period of time…but they could definitely contend…at the 1 Kidd at the 2 Redd at the 3 Daniels at the 4 Dirk at the 5 JO!!!!!!!! ....if they can get the chemistry right and put some egos aside thats could be something special…would have to pick up some bench depth dont you think???How would that work giving up all those peices.

kiddisaster

by aaronp on May 27, 2008 11:40 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Easy.

PG-KIdd Rush Barea
SG-Redd Daniels
SF-Smith Stackhouse
PF-Dirk Bass
C-O’Neal Diop Howard

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 28, 2008 8:03 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

In what Bizarro World...

Can we afford to give Josh Smith 15.5 million dollars without going the S&T route?

by N41D on May 28, 2008 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just add up the team's salary, subtract Dampier, Howard, Terry, and Jones.

Then add Smith, Redd, O’Neal, Diop, Juwan Howard, Barea, Daniels, and Rush. I might not have added Stackhouse, but even if I did miss him, we would still be under the 105 million salary that we were at last year.

Brandon Webb, do I need to say more?

by srdmad on May 28, 2008 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs