Josh Howard to Toronto? Hoopsworld speculating on a crazy deal

by Norsktroll on Jan 7, 2009 7:50 AM CST Comment 35 comments

A deal being discussed would send troubled forward Josh Howard to the Raptors in a deal that would land Andrea Bargnani and Anthony Parker in Dallas, with a combination that could involve DeSagana Diop and Antoine Wright headed back to Toronto.

I can see how that makes Toronto better, but how should that help Dallas contend in any way? Andrea Bargnani, picked #1 in 2006, is one of the most undefined players in terms of position in the NBA and on the brink of being washed out back to Europe. Is he a power forward (probably his natural position)? A small forward? Even a center? He can create matchup problems, but usually not in a good way and especially not on defense a la Prince, Marion, Artest. Parker is a nice player who might start immediately as a shooting guard for the Mavs, but he is 33, older than Terry. I really hope Cuban and Donnie could get more out of J-Ho should they really want to trade him. Maybe Jermaine O'Neal could be involved to shore up the frontcourt? Even that might not be the deal to put the Mavs on the next level.

P.S.: Howard for Bargnani and Parker straight up would at least work in terms of salaries

(Please excuse if that's really just a Fanshot, but I found it kind of interesting to discuss.)

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Bargnani

is going to be washed out back to Europe? He’s averaging over 20 ppg in his last 4 games…What are you smoking?

"Sooner or later, prospects kill you, because you hang onto them." - Greggo, 11/22/2005

by Agreen07 on Jan 7, 2009 8:04 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Bargnani
SEASON FG% FT% P/40 R/40 A/40 TS% Ast TO Usg Reb PER
2006-07 .427 .824 18.4 6.3 1.2 54.6 5.9 12.7 19.8 9.2 12.85
2007-08 .386 .840 17.0 6.2 1.9 49.5 9.1 9.0 20.3 9.2 10.96
2008-09 .424 .868 16.4 6.6 1.4 53.7 7.7 10.4 17.9 9.7 12.83

Howard
2006-07 .459 .827 21.5 7.7 2.1 54.8 8.7 8.5 22.9 11.6 20.02
2007-08 .455 .813 22.0 7.7 2.4 53.4 9.7 6.7 23.6 11.2 18.53
2008-09 .443 .744 22.2 6.4 2.1 51.6 8.1 8.4 24.5 8.9 16.40

A PER of under 15 (league average) is not exactly worthy of a #1 pick. His next deal in the NBA will be far worse than what he could get in Europe if he doesn’t improve his shooting asap.

by Norsktroll on Jan 7, 2009 8:13 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

4 games = not an impressive sample size

I’ll pass on 42% from the floor and another defender without a position (ala Dirk … too slow for a good 3, too weak for a dominant 4/5).

by MeanMr.Mustard on Jan 7, 2009 7:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I think

this is a terrible trade. I’d rather keep Howard.

by smg31085 on Jan 7, 2009 8:10 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Crazy is the right word

Josh is a starter, we should be getting a starter in return too. Bargs has turned out to be a bust (or at least it seems that way right now).

By the way, Norsktroll…I saw that Darius Miles played last night :) Seven whole minutes!

Recommended viewing: "Slumdog Millionaire"

by Marie on Jan 7, 2009 8:36 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

OT: He also had "Block of the Night" on NBA.com. And then he was waived before boarding the team plane :)

Although Dave (http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/1/6/710239/darius-miles-revisited) and our resident CBA expert on BE try to talk us off the ledge, it’s not yet really safe, since teams have quite some incentives to play him as I tried to outline (http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/1/5/709833/the-darius-miles-chronicle). Darius is like a bad penny, always coming back.

by Norsktroll on Jan 7, 2009 8:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

You guys write essays over at BE

Which is not a complaint, by any means. I wish I sounded that knowledgable about basketball. As for Miles, well…two down, eight more to go, right?

Recommended viewing: "Slumdog Millionaire"

by Marie on Jan 7, 2009 8:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That was probably my longest post there, I’m trying out a new writing tool :)
Dave’s weekly output is crazy, Bill Simmons has nothing on him.

by Norsktroll on Jan 7, 2009 9:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Miles just got waived.

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/01/07/010709grizzlies.miles.ap/index.html?rss=true

www.mavsmoneyball.com

by Wes Cox on Jan 7, 2009 11:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Miles waived

Interesting that Portland is stating that is going to sue whoever signs him, I love it! So Memphis signs Miles and wrecks the Trailblazers off season FA plans and nets each team in the NBA 250k (via the luxury tax). I love it! Sucks for Portland fans though!

by mrichardson70 on Jan 10, 2009 2:17 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Please

Please don’t give Bill Ingram the satisfaction of even discussing this. As if that hack has sources.

by jthig32 on Jan 7, 2009 8:58 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

If the Mavs

have said they won’t trade Howard for Gerald Wallace it’s pretty hard to believe they would even consider this.

www.mavsmoneyball.com

by Wes Cox on Jan 7, 2009 9:31 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Get rid of Howard for the best you can get

He makes the Mavs worse.

Not a big fan of this deal though, unless Donnie really thinks Bargnani is going to turn into something. Dirk and him together leaves 2 spots pretty defenseless.

by Beasticon on Jan 7, 2009 10:06 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

first of all it doesent work, second of all at least we got one of the best PG’s in exchange for harris. I f we do this deal we wud get a whole bunch of poop while j-ho prolly starts ballin in toronto. its just his ankle right now hes gonna be fine and at leaast all htis bad stuff abotu him is happening now rather then playoff time.

by mavsss41 on Jan 7, 2009 12:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

ankle

was his ankle hurt last year in the playoffs also? has it been hurt this whole year except for the one clippers game?

Josh can still be a very good player if he wants to be. However, its clear he doesnt want to be right now, right here.

by kumizi on Jan 7, 2009 2:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i gotta stop comparing Mavs to girlfriends

Josh is like a crazy but sexy girlfriend. When hes bad hes horrible but when hes good theres no comparison. Anthony would be a great SG fit into the system and Bargnani is on the upslide. Its just having Dirk and then “Dirk-lite” wouldn’t really fit. Plus Howard is great trade material for the 2010 player bonanza coming up.

I wish we traded Howard for Smith, hes a defensive dynamo and athletic freak but with some troublesome baggage.

Smell it, taste it.

by Tastypoopies on Jan 7, 2009 2:34 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Josh sucks...

I don’t see why people would be complaining about this… Especially if it meant getting out from under Diop’s contract…

If Cuban and Little Nellie make this move, it’s clearly about money and 2010… Terry and Dirk would be the only players with guaranteed money on payroll in 2010, and you’d be looking at the possibility of 2 big-time FA signings if Dirk is truely interested in taking a paycut to make this team better…

Josh Howard doesn’t make this team better anymore… Whatever he’s producing can be replaced…

by N41D on Jan 7, 2009 2:37 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

could not agree more

People need to wake up and realize that Josh doesn’t even try anymore. It’s not just about numbers. With the way Josh is playing now, this trade would be a steal if we can get rid of Diop’s contract.

by kumizi on Jan 7, 2009 2:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Right on.

As long as Diop’s contract is going with and I would do this deal, if it’s the best one we can get.

I have witnessed time and time again.

by srdmad on Jan 7, 2009 4:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Mavs were better before

Mavs were winning more before Cheech Howard came back from his injury.

Deal him for what you can get and move on.

by Beasticon on Jan 7, 2009 4:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Trade

Howard for Parker and Bargnani works, but I see this as the beginning of a three way deal. Bargnani goes somewhere else in exchange for a shooting guard and Dallas gives up Diop and his contract for maybe Jawai for center depth. I’ll play around with some multi team deals later tonight.

Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on Jan 7, 2009 5:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Jermaine O'Neal

Would O’Neal be attractive to Dallas? How about this trade?

Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!

by DerekSTheRed on Jan 8, 2009 4:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

lol

No reason to trade Howard for half a season of O’Neal. I wouldn’t mind signing him to the MLE this offseason.

"My mother always taught me that if the only thing you have to say is,
‘(Expletive) Dave Samson,’ then don’t say anything at all.
So I’m not going to say anything at all.
Is my mother the greatest or what?"
- Mariners GM Bill Bavasi, after signing Ichiro to a $90 million contract

by tyd3311 on Jan 9, 2009 3:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

We shouldn't be making

deals for “2010 cap space” like those despicable Knicks, because one, we’re still in with a marginal chance of contending and two, it isn’t certain that we’ll be able to pick up a big-name free agent in 2010. LeBron could go to New York, Bosh might stay in Canada, Wade could go back to Chicago or stay in Miami…etc., etc.

If we’re going to trade Josh, we have to aim for equal value. Parker and Bargnani is not that.

by jonthefon on Jan 7, 2009 7:41 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

False

no marginal chance at contending, think championship, think Lebron/Wade + Dirk

by BuckyB on Jan 7, 2009 10:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Are we that confident

we’ll be getting one of them? Cuban’ll be needing to pull all his magic tricks to do that.

by jonthefon on Jan 8, 2009 5:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

joe johnson

wouldnt be a bad consolation prize

by kumizi on Jan 8, 2009 8:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Okay

I’d be up for that.

by jonthefon on Jan 8, 2009 3:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

contending

what? A Championship? Seriously?

by mrichardson70 on Jan 10, 2009 2:19 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

"Anything can happen"

wink wink, nudge nudge.

by jonthefon on Jan 10, 2009 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Bargnani has been on fire as of late

I’d pull the trigger if we could get Diop in the deal

by Beasticon on Jan 7, 2009 10:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

If we did get Parker,

would we be able to play Terry, Parker, and Kidd in the 4th together without having defensive problems? I’m not too sure on that.

I have witnessed time and time again.

by srdmad on Jan 10, 2009 12:50 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Anyone like this trade. Solomon and Graham are in there to match salaries.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=9922006298727596351023&teams=28286666&te=&cash=

I have witnessed time and time again.

by srdmad on Jan 10, 2009 1:12 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I would trade Josh

for a Jeff Green type and an expiring contract. Move Jkidd for picks and large expiring contract as well and start over. You have to be aggressive! Lets do it… We are not winning a championship with the 3-12 players that we have on this roster

by mrichardson70 on Jan 10, 2009 2:22 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

If we're trading Josh

it’s for equal value or similar value in one player and then a throw-in, or it’s for the sake of a rebuilding phase where we would try deal Kidd for the kind of deal you suggest.

by jonthefon on Jan 10, 2009 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs