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Well, that really sucked.  Dallas is down 3-0.  The 08/09 season will most likely be over in the next week.  And as hard as I I try to focus on the other aspects of the game and series that got Dallas to this point, all I can think of is Antoine Wright, Carmelo Anthony, and Mark Wunderlich.

There's no doubt Wright fouled Carmelo.  It's an undeniable fact given that the NBA admitted it 3 hours too late, but I do wonder why Wright left any doubt as to what he was doing.  When you give morons the opportunity to make a mistake they usually will.  Wright explained his foul after the game.

"All night long, the whistle was blowing fast," Wright said. "At the end of the game, when we're blatantly trying to foul, the whistle wasn't blowing. I was positive a whistle was coming, just like everybody else was positive the whistle was coming.

"What do you want me to do? Do you want me to Derek Fisher him, just take him out, and then I get a flagrant foul late in the game? I can't blatantly run through the guy."

And sure, it's easy to make the case that playing at home in a must win game that Dallas should have just put the game out of reach.  Free throws were missed.  Dirk's final shot was suspect.   Dallas shouldn't have let it come down to the wire to begin with.  Jason Kidd certainly didn't want to blame the non-call for the loss.

"The game didn't come down to that last play," Kidd said. "We tried to take a foul and didn't get that. You've got to make plays down the stretch and we didn't do that."

And that's true.  But even with their mistakes, Dallas had put themselves in a position to win, and they had managed to navigate the fourth quarter and save a foul that is useful in exactly that final situation.

It's also true that if the foul had been called Denver still might have won the game.  And yeah, if Carmelo had missed the shot it may have actually worked in the Mavs favor, but then it would just be the Nuggets complaining.

But a wrong call is a wrong call, and that call did matter.  It may not have been the only reason Dallas lost the game.  And it certainly didn't cost Dallas the series -- they never were the favorite after all.  If Dallas had won yesterday odds are they still go on to get knocked out, but they still would have had chance.  Now they basically don't, and the NBA has admitted their official played a significant role in that. 

How are Mavs fans supposed to feel?  How is the team?

Whatever the feeling is, it's all too familiar.

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Comments

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QFT

But even with their mistakes, Dallas had put themselves in a position to win, and they had managed to navigate the fourth quarter and save a foul that comes in handy in exactly that final situation.

I am sick and tired people complaining about Dirk missing shots he normally makes, the Mavs missing FTs they normally make, Wright not fouling hard enough, and whatever else convenient outlet for some (insert player name here) haters to come out of their holes.

Bottom line is, the Mavs, for all their faults in the 4th quarter, were in the position to win the game, and by doing so have (in a way) undone those said mistakes. I am so angry that we lost. But I am more angry that the refs cost us a chance to win the game.

by ptrck on May 10, 2009 11:51 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I still feel gutted, but this dose of rationality is much appreciated

Any word on Josh and whether or not he’ll be suspended?

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 10, 2009 12:04 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

if j-ho is suspended...

that would be the ultimate screw job. im not one to think that the nba is out to get the mavs. I think weve been rather unlucky and gotten screwed over but not by any decision by the commish. I just think that after admitting that you got something wrong, a players reaction to that wrong call has to be forgiven

by longhorn3621 on May 11, 2009 3:01 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He verbally attacked the refs after the game

He has to be suspended, doesn’t he? If the NBA allows that type of behavior they aren’t protecting the referees any longer.

MHH: Shagging Dater one contributor at a time.

by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What do you care?

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anything that helps the Nugs get the sweep

Would be good in my book. Plus I think it would be the right call. Bad call or not at the end of the game, you can’t let someone attack an official, especially after a game.

MHH: Shagging Dater one contributor at a time.

by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's not like it matters anymore anyway

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey

At least you guys beat the hated Spurs. And haven’t been blown out at home by 58.

MHH: Shagging Dater one contributor at a time.

by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah yes

Moral victories. Dallas sports fans are used to those.

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

jho will be suspended for 10 games to start next season

after he punches someone tonight

"Daryl (Morey, the Rockets general manager) and I were talking this morning. We both discussed how great Tracy is in the playoffs. There's very few people who have the ability to step up their games in the playoffs and he does. So we're not looking to run away from Tracy." - Houston Rockets Owner, Leslie Alexander

muhahahaha WTF?!?!

by zkmavz on May 11, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's crazy man

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ha

crazzzzy man

so gettin alot of work done today?

"Daryl (Morey, the Rockets general manager) and I were talking this morning. We both discussed how great Tracy is in the playoffs. There's very few people who have the ability to step up their games in the playoffs and he does. So we're not looking to run away from Tracy." - Houston Rockets Owner, Leslie Alexander

muhahahaha WTF?!?!

by zkmavz on May 11, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

tons

damn meeting here in few so I can talk about all the work i’ve done today.

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nice post, Wes.

rec’d. It’s one thing to carry yourself in a way that doesn’t blame losses on officials and accepts responsibility for one’s missed opportunities. It’s another to say that because there were those opportunities, a blatantly blown call at the end didn’t change the outcome.

Every time Tim Duncan whines, an angel gets its wings.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 12:25 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't recommend reading Pickaxe and Roll's take on this.

Classless. He spends the entire time blaming the victim, even going so far as to say he disagrees with the NBA for admitting the call was wrong.

Am I going to disagree with the NBA and the Dallas coach, owner, and player? You better believe it.

I’ve usually found SB Nation to have better taste in bloggers than that.

Every time Tim Duncan whines, an angel gets its wings.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 12:30 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

+1.

S-St. Louis, R-Rams, D-Dallas, M-Mavericks, A-Arizona, D-Diamondbacks.

by srdmad on May 10, 2009 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Classless?

Agreed. That’s been the take of all of the Nuggets fans that I’ve seen- “I don’t care if the NBA demonstrates that I’m factually wrong. I will disagree with the sanctioning body which sets the rules of the sport on what those rules actually are.”

And I don’t really get it, but this is a trend that’s pretty much existed from every team we’ve played in the playoffs over the last few years of MMB’s existence. Nuggets fans, as bad as they are, are a thousand times more rational than the GSW fans (who seemed to lack command of the English language as well as understanding of basic rules of behavior).

I really do wonder why that is. Is it just a factor of commenting on your own blog versus someone elses? I don’t really think so, since it seems like the GSW and Nuggets blogs are nothing but homerisms even when discussing among themselves. I’ve yet to see any substantive discussions that come close to some of the breakdowns we’ve gotten here on MMB. Is it a demographic difference? Perhaps MMB has an older average age? Most of the people I know here are either in college or already graduated. Maybe it’s following the lead of good bloggers like Wes and Jake and Toddy? I don’t know what it is, but I know that I’d never find myself commenting on the other blogs, even if I was a fan of that team.

by BrodyV on May 10, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm all for some friendly needling.

I mean, I hate the Spurs and realize their fans hate the Mavs, and that’s part of the fun of it all. And yes, everyone complains about the refs, and everyone has a different perspective. But I’d like to think that when clear wrongs occur – to the point that the NBA even comes out and says something – regardless of who you root for, you could admit it and move on.

I don’t know a single person who isn’t a Nuggets fan that doesn’t think some degree of injustice occurred at the end. If you want to make the point that Wright could’ve done a better job of selling it, yadda yadda, that’s fine. But call a spade a spade.

Every time Tim Duncan whines, an angel gets its wings.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How bizarre

So BrodyV, you think the NBA league office is infallible?

Am I factually wrong if I posit that, just perhaps, the NBA royally screwed the pooch in not assessing a greater penalty to Rondo after his blatant headshot to Brad Miller, a good two feet away from the ball? Or his attack on Hinrich?

Similarly, one might maintain that the officials made the correct [non]call here and not be some kind of factually-challenged moron. It means one has a different point of view.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 10:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The officials on the court made the wrong call

The league confirmed it. Anyone that isn’t a Denver homer admits it. Coming here and incessantly bitching about a game that you won is classless.

Does that cover it?

Your questions about Rondo are an all too common falacy with people who want to argue over the internet- the common misdirection. But what about the Palestinians! You never talk about how their homes get bulldozed! But what about the Israelis! You never talk about the rocket attacks!

Guess what. I’m not talking about Rondo because it’s not relevant to this discussion. The question is whether the official made the correct call at the end of the Mavericks-Nuggets game. They did not. Continuing to insist that they did does in fact make you a moron.

by BrodyV on May 10, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow...

That’s some amazing misdirection of your own — Palenstinians on a basketball blog!? Hilarious.

Look, the point is clearly that just because some clown in the NBA says it’s so does not make it indisputably correct. We’re all entitled to our own opinions, and engaging in debate about a game is not classless. And I don’t see my posts as (a) bitching or (b) incessant, but, hey, you’r entitled to your own opinion. Perhaps hypersensitivity and outrage are coloring your judgment.

Wright barely made any contact and then immediately bounced away with his hands in the air. As TNT observed, the ref was correctly looking at Melo’s feet to get the 2-or-3-pt call correct. The first “foul” was clearly a legitimate swipe at the ball. If Wright wanted to foul, and foul competently, he woudl have wrapped Melo up then. Instead, he took a weak slap at him, the kind of weak hand-check that sometimes-is-and-sometimes-is-not called. And then he backed away with his hands in the air. I like watching basketball players play and decide games, as opposed to seeing refs blow their whistle constantly. It’s a different opinion. People have them. Deal with it.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm neither

Hypersensitive nor outraged. I think this particular game was poorly officiated throughout, an incorrect call was made which directly determined the outcome of both a game and the series, and that the NBA has a significant problem with the integrity of its officiating that it’s never taken any step towards addressing. The league has had at least one official fixing games in the freaking playoffs, admitted a series of blown calls in this years playoffs (including upgrading and downgrading flagrants), and it’s nothing but an open secret that the name on a player’s jersey is more important than the action of the court in determining whether a foul is called or not. But hey, you’re entitled to your own opinion. Frankly, this series is now over. I doubt I’d watch any more of it even if the Mavericks win the next one. All I want to see is the NBA have some accountability for admitted errors.

There were two fouls. The President of Basketball Operations confirmed within three hours that there were two fouls. But you apparently know the rulebook better than he does. He’s a clown, and you’re clearly not. Congrats.

(Also, I see that you complain about my analogy, and then implicitly acknowledge that it’s correct by dropping your “look over here” routine. Thanks for that, at least)

by BrodyV on May 10, 2009 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

no

Your analogy is absurd. I dropped the Rondo comment because apparently your grip on reality is limited — as I re-iterated, the NBA league office is not infallible, and I disagree with it here. My purported “look over here” routine was merely an attempt to illustrate how the NBA league office can review things and still (in the mind of most observers) screw the pooch, as, surely, the vast, vast majority non-Celtics fans can agree that Rondo got the benefit of not one but two ridiculous non-decisions from the league.

But if you think citing Rondo’s conduct in arguing that the NBA league office is capable of making mistakes is equivalent to a non sequitur about Palestinians, well, I really don’t know what to say to you.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Again, the point

I don’t care if the league is infallible or not. If you’ll bother reading, that’s my entire point. The question is whether they got this call right. In the mind of everyone outside of the Denver Metro Area, they did not. That’s the point. That is all. I personally don’t give one flying fuck about Rajon Rondo, or anyone else that plays in the Eastern Conference. I care about whether the calls are right in the games the Dallas Mavericks are playing. They were not. You can “disagree”, but reality is not on your side.

by BrodyV on May 10, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe you should just root for whoever has the best chance of winning, then you can be an oblivious dickhead whenever people get mad that their local team gets shafted. I imagine it’s much more fun that way.

GO LEBRON/KOBE/TOM BRADY/EVERY BASEBALL PLAYER ON STEROIDS!!!!!!

by Doctor_Apocalypse on May 10, 2009 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

so far you have done nothing other than assert that the call in-game was wrong, based purely on the League and your repeated slinging of insults. Some argument, and, yes, it does pretty much boil down to you resting your case on the league.

On the other hand, I have pointed out where the ref’s eyes were (correctly) looking (at the 3-pt line) and how Wright jumped with his hands in the air, and how weak slap/hand-check is not universally called. I suppose these points are not persuasive to you, but surely they are more of a good faith argument that pointing only to the league’s decision and calling me a homer (which is odd, since I live in KC, a mortal enemy of Denver sports).

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 11:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

this is insane

you are saying that the league, coach, and everyone outside of Denver is wrong.

I’m a Blazer fan, and that was a foul.

draft dejuan blair

by Cablinasian on May 10, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well said, Brody

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on May 11, 2009 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you can't use an analogy about changing the subject

to accuse him of changing the subject…

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 11, 2009 1:34 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Classless?

I don’t see what is classless about that. A difference of opinion is not classlessness.

Further, Nate points to an interesting observation from Barkley & TNT—


More on the non-call heard round the world:

Watching TNT’s pregame show tonight (before Game 4 of the Celtics/Magic game), Charles Barkley pointed out an interesting tidbit along with rolling replay of Melo’s final shot.

Barkley had viewers focus on Mark Wunderlich and pointed out how Wunderlich was watching Melo’s feet as Melo got close to the three point line to make sure he was behind the three-point line. Sure enough, Wunderlich’s head was tilted down and he indeed appeared to be focused on Melo’s feet.

All the more reason you’d hope Wright would have bear hugged Melo on that final play and not left the foul call up to chance, which as we’ve all seen in the NBA countless times will have mixed results.

This viewing that Barkley pointed out gave all the more reason to how Wunderlich didn’t see Wright’s hack. I believe that Wright’s throwing up of his arms and the fact that he was behind Melo with other officials not in the best line of view all played a part to the perfect storm of that foul not getting called.

But go ahead & ignore that analysis, and baselessly attack him as classless for possessing a different opinion than yours.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Class

Class, in my mind, requires winning with humility. Not acknowledging an unfair element that directly swayed the game into your favor is not winning with humility. Outright denying that the unfair element even occurred, coupled with patting Melo on the back for being heroic in making a wide open three I think clearly falls under the realm of classless.

It’s like bragging after winning with loaded dice.

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 11, 2009 1:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And, frankly,

Where Wunderlich’s eyes were or were not doesn’t change the fact that the foul was missed. We can go round and round on WHY the foul was missed, and I’ll be the first to admit that, in retrospect, Wright could’ve done more to sell the foul … but that’s exactly the point. You shouldn’t have to sell a foul. Not in the playoffs. Not in the last possession when the refs should be on high alert. Not when you clearly have a foul to give, and you have not only reached in, but also bumped the ball handler’s body right in front of the ref.

You’re right, a difference of opinion isn’t classless. Except when that difference of opinion could only come about through some ridiculously self-serving motivation — in this case, apparently that he’d rather glorify the Nuggets’ hard-fought victory than admit what anyone with a shred of credibility should have said: “I wish this game had been decided by the play on the court, without this officiating blunder hanging over everyone’s head.”

If he really, honestly thinks that shouldn’t have reasonably been called a foul, then his view of reality is incredibly distorted.

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 11, 2009 1:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

if whether or not his feet were behind the line is reviewable

then why should he be watching that when a foul is not reviewable. seems to me that i would be watching what i cant take a second look at…

by longhorn3621 on May 11, 2009 3:09 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My eyeballs have been bulging out of my head for the past 20 or so hours like Tim Duncan when he does his “What? Me foul?” face.

These playoffs have been ridiculous. I’m not just talking about the non-call, which was especially infuriating because I’m a Mavs fan. I’m talking about across the board. I’m still waiting for the league to call that flagrant on Rondo. Helen Keller would make a better referee than some of these dinosaurs they’ve got calling the games.

Note to David Stern: You can pass all the dress codes you want to try to clean up the league’s image, but all the sweater vests in the world aren’t going to change the fact that these playoffs have been decided by a bunch of thugs: the ones with tattoos on their necks socking people in the throat and the ones with whistles.

by Doctor_Apocalypse on May 10, 2009 1:06 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Kobe's elbow to Artest

was the coup de grâce for me. The league failing to impose sanctions for that is inexcusable and reeks of abject and Wade like favoritism. Stern’s NBA has no credibility left IMO

by alphamav on May 10, 2009 1:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

No kidding

The fact that I get angry about players on teams that I have no interest in means something is seriously wrong.

Basketball is turning into a violent clusterfuck…. football is being watered down to the point where the quarterback might as well have to wear a belt of flags around his waist because you can’t touch him… what is this world coming to?

Anybody remember SLAMBALL? Now THAT’S a sport that had some credibility.

by Doctor_Apocalypse on May 10, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Did you watch it?

Have you seen all the replays of that “vicious” elbow to Ron-Ron’s mid-chest?

I suspect not, otherwise you wouldn’t be so outraged. Ron-Ron lost it and dramatized a nothing play, and the reverse angle replay from ESPN that finally surfaced proved it.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 10:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Blatantly Wrong

I think it’s pretty funny that the refs cost us the chance to win the game. Well I guess to be fair Wright did. I mean tapping someone at the three line in the last 5 seconds of a game then throwing your hands up as if you weren’t trying to foul is NOT blatantly trying to foul someone. If only the Nuggets flopped then it would have been blatantly obvious. So as the mavs end their season, it’s pretty obvious that the only people they have to blame is themselves.

by sn on May 10, 2009 1:47 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Ref: Was there a foul?

"I didn’t see a foul. I don’t know’’Nuggets coach George Karl, commenting on the Wright-‘Melo incident, playing dumb all too effectively.

that cracked me up :)

The Charles Barkley Ancestors Count: 23 Grandmothers, 0 Mother

The Charles Barkley Playoff Ancestors Count: 5 Grandmothers , 0 Mother

"There were arms coming from everywhere, and I knew they weren’t going for the ball," Miller said. "I was just trying to get [the shot] up before they called some crap like ‘on the ground.’ "

by DOH on May 10, 2009 2:53 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

yeah, it ticked me off at the time

but looking back, that was pretty funny. He did a hell of a job of keeping a straight face.

Every time Tim Duncan whines, an angel gets its wings.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Saddest part of all this

While some Mavs are on the court hooting and hollering, Nuggets are celebrating on the court like a bunch of Twyla Tharp dancers, Cuban is yelling….

The shot of Dirk just walking to the locker room head down and somber is all too heart breaking. I seriously hope that if we can’t build him a team to win a title here and soon, that we can send him to NY/LA/anywhere that will give him the superstar calls that he just doesn’t seem to get. That guy deserves a fucking title, if not with us, then with someone at least.

Rock Flag & Eagle Radio: Thursdays 10 PM - 1 AM on FM 88.7 The Choice
"Computers can’t measure the size of a man’s heart."
- Hawk Harrelson, MLB Guru/Analyst

by Maximilian on May 10, 2009 3:05 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Nuggets celebration

Are you kidding? The Nuggets were down by 4 with 40 seconds left to play. They win by 1 on a last second 3 and you expect them to walk off the court with their heads down? That was an emotional victory (and understandably an emotional loss for the Mavs).
As for Dirk, I agree with you. That guy is an offensive stud, surrounded by parts that don’t complement his play. I realize that injury is part of it and that Cuban has done a lot to improve the team, but the Mavs need a viable inside threat. You can’t free Dirk from the double-team with outside shooters as Dirk’s preference is not to post up.

by NuggBuckets on May 11, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agree 100%

Mavs need more of a low post presence to compliment Dirk.

MHH: Shagging Dater one contributor at a time.

by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2009 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he was more commenting on the contrast between

Dirk and everyone else… not necessarily condemning the Nuggets for celebrating.

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 11, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, guys, I really don’t think the Nuggets would’ve made a big deal out of the no-call if Melo had missed. Think about it … of all the reasons they would’ve lost the game, of all the questionable calls … that one? That was the best look Melo was going to get in the last 6 seconds, bar none. This one only boils down to Mavs fans complaining because they lost.

by iwishiwasaballer on May 10, 2009 4:07 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Stop the Complaints

I hate when people blame other outside reasons for there team blowing. It was a great game and it sucked to see one of the teams lose, but Denver made 2 of 17 FG in the first quarter, How come Dallas was not able to build a little bigger of a cushion with that, The Nuggs looked horrible and some how were still in the game at the end of the first, there was a lot Dallas could have done with the first 47 min and 59 sec to win that game it did not come down to one play.

by ffeng17 on May 10, 2009 4:31 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Lets not forget

that regardless of that no-call, I hate to break the news, but you’re not going to beat us in this series. Do any of you really think that Dallas has the gas to get past us? You’re kidding yourself if you do. Even up 2-1 instead of 3-0, I still think we win the series. I just hope some goon off your bench doesn’t pull some shit in the next game. I’d forefit this next one in Dallas and then roll you up in Denver to finish it off if we could…

Denver is 10 deep and you don’t have anything legit beyond Terry off the bench, and aside from Terry, and Dirk and Howard’s gimpy ankles, you’re not scaring anybody. Oh and by the way, Carlisle is a total donk and you’ll be calling for his head soon enough if you haven’t been already. Seemingly nice enough guy but he’s just not NBA head coach material. I had to suffer thru his “consistently coming up short” coaching in my years in Detroit (as a passive fan) and you will be yearning for the Avery Johnson years until he’s gone. He looks like he should be a sit-com dad instead of a coach.

I also think that he is a good summation of your team in general. Too many nice guys, not enough diesel. Dirk and Terry are nice guys and quality players but you have no intimidation factor on your team. Howard? Laughable. Dampier? Constantly has a look on his face like he’d rather be fishing or that he can’t wait to be done playing basketball, plus he sucks in general.

I’m not here to attack the Mavs or their fans, but rather to tell you that you need a facelift, big time. I DO hate Cuban though… he’s a douche. Maybe the karma gods won’t let you win until he’s gone… which won’t happen til he dies in 30 years or gets banished.

One call or not though, you know we have the better team. And our star doesn’t get engaged to craigslist transvestites.

by stiffy on May 10, 2009 5:41 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

You're a fucking idiot...

Before you get the balls to post on the opposing team’s boards, do a little research. If you polled the vast majority of member of MMB, you’d understand that most of us were elated that the mavs just got out of the 8th seed. No one on here is complaining about how we got our title stripped from us because of the noncall. Go read the posts from the loss to OKC, the last minute comeback to the Clips. We’ve never said that this team has all of the right pieces to be the champ. The argument since the conclusion of the game into the wee hours and again today is that the ref’s decided the game. It’s not about the Thugs or the Soft Mavs, it’s about a game of basketball that wasn’t decided by the players on the court.

That being said, your team, now, next year, three years from now will never win a championship. You won’t have a team that has the playoff streak that the Mavs have, and you will never have a player that is the quality of one, Dirk Nowitzki.

by bbob on May 10, 2009 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

"I'm not here to attack the Mavs or their fans..."

“our star doesn’t get engaged to craigslist transvestites.”

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 6:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm just going to say that the only reason your team is in the playoffs,

because another team was being stupid and decided to trade Billups for AI.

S-St. Louis, R-Rams, D-Dallas, M-Mavericks, A-Arizona, D-Diamondbacks.

by srdmad on May 10, 2009 6:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow, your team gets past the first round of the playoffs for the first time since your mom shat you out, and suddenly they’re the fucking Harlem Globetrotters.

by Doctor_Apocalypse on May 10, 2009 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you are a goddamn idiot

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 10, 2009 9:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No seriously

A team can win after losing the first two away games. It happens. Have you ever heard the one about series starting after the away team wins a game? Well assuming the mavs had won like they should’ve the series would still be ours to win. Yes, we don’t mind awkwardly losing the first two games. We only needed to win one in denver, and we’d only lost half of our opportunities. I’m not saying it was going to be easy, only that we had a good chance.

If you watched anything aside from nuggets games you would see how commonly our bench scores 30, 40, or 50 points. Terry, Barea, Singleton, Hollins, and Bass all bring incredible energy and any three can have a great night any night. By the way, Carlisle is not known as a softie, he’s known more as a hardass.

And hey just because all of our players aren’t total douchebag jerks covered in tattoos doesn’t mean we aren’t a great team.

Good luck making the playoffs 9 years in a row with so many assholes on one team with only Chauncey and a whimpy coach to hold it together.

by jbuskmiller on May 10, 2009 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

amazing what one year of success can do to a loser franchise's fans

Thanks for signing up for an account just to post this wonderful piece of writing. Surely, you’re mother, dead or alive, will be proud of you. Now go get a knife and run into it.

by ptrck on May 10, 2009 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You know

I know the Mavs have been pretty solid for about a decade or so, but honestly, have you guys forgotten how shitty you were for the a long time? I know everyone around here is upset, and some of the Nuggets fans coming over here haven’t helped by being assholes, but this attitude you guys have taken on is kind of ridiculous.

Have you guys forgotten when you won a combined 25 games in two seasons in the early 90s? Just ten short seasons ago you guys won 19 games. Did you ever imagine you’d be sitting here a decade later and popping off like you’re one of the kings of the game even though you’re still without a title (and I DO agree you guys got royally screwed in ’06)?

Your “one year of success” is also a little bit skewed. While we certainly haven’t been a force to be reckoned with in the postseason, we’ve made the playoffs 6 straight seasons, and after so many years of futility, I would constitute those as successful years, if for no other reason than because we were so god awful for so long.

I’ve held off on commenting on this game on either site because what was a close game is completely overshadowed by officiating, and it breaks my heart that sports so frequently come to that. It causes fans of the opposing teams to spew shit at each other instead of rational conversation, and that’s too bad.

On a final note, the way people here have lobbed the “classless” grenade at the Nuggets fans while calling them various forms of fucking idiots and telling them to run into knives sounds a hell of a lot like the pot calling the kettle black.

If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding! HOW can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?!

by SlamDunkTheFunk on May 10, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

well

Two can play that game and we’re just hitting back. And why would you even bring up the ‘90s? Next thing you know, some of you guys will be bringing up when the City of Dallas had no NBA franchise and you guys had one before we did. Going that route is not a good argument; it’s not even an argument. (On a side note: Mavs fans, if you’re still boasting about beating the Spurs in ‘06, please stop. It’s not that relevant anymore. But I digress.)

Simply put: Why come in our house (not just talking about you) and talk shit? I don’t know if some of the Moneyball regulars interlope at the Nuggets SB Blog, so I can’t tell if we do. I personally don’t. But then again, why talk shit when you’re winning the series? And why keep doing so when FACTUALLY speaking, the refs indeed (unintentionally) screwed us. I don’t get it. As basketball fans, is there any guilt on you guys’ part for reaping the benefits of that crap no-call, hence your insisting on trying your best to make it seem like not-crap? Come on, I won’t tell anyone. (I kid, I kid…)

Seriously. As the first poster in this topic, I reiterate what I said: on top of being pissed off about losing (and if you’re not pissed when your team loses, especially in the playoffs and to a team you haven’t beaten in OVER A YEAR[!!!], then you must start questioning your heart for the team) we are livid about the refs costing us a CHANCE to win the game. Not the game, the CHANCE! Nobody’s saying we had it in the bag. But with, what, 4-7 seconds to go and up by 2 and a foul to give that the Mavs GAVE, we definitely had our chance and they were pretty good. It was taken away.

Put yourselves in our shoes, even for just one minute. If you still want to continue this super serious internet pseudo-bickering, then fine. I am done talking about this, and I hope you guys are as well. We both have a G4 to look forward to.

by ptrck on May 10, 2009 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Errr...?
amazing what one year of success can do to a loser franchise’s fans

That is what I really had the problem with. You’re calling us a “loser franchise” when in fact, the Mavs haven’t exactly lit the world on fire in their history. My problem stemmed from you attacking my franchise, in which I was “just hitting back”. My point was that I thought Mavs fans might be grateful that their team has been so successful and that they have had the CHANCE to care about fouls in the second round of the playoffs. Instead, you copped this attitude of “you guys are a one-hit wonder and should so some respect to those of us who have been around this block for years”.

Quite frankly, I think you missed the entire point of my post. I mean, completely. If it makes you feel better, absolutely that no-call was bullshit. I, a Nuggets fan, believe the lack of a foul there was completely indefensible and trying to see fans of my team rationalizing it so they don’t look like the bad guys is ridiculous. It was a missed call. It was bullshit. You guys have every reason to be upset. I’m not being patronizing, either. \

But sure. We can stop all this silly “super serious internet pseudo-bickering”. GL in G4. Hopefully the players decide it and not a bunch of stripes.

If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding! HOW can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?!

by SlamDunkTheFunk on May 11, 2009 1:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

fair enough

You protect your franchise, and I respect that. Pardon me for bringing it up because some of your fellow Nugget fans (definitely not you) have the balls to come in here and actually start putting fuel to the fire, so to speak. My lengthy post was a culmination (I guess not really since I’m here again lol) of the annoying Nugz fans interlopers we’ve been having here, not merely a post in reply to yours. I got your point.

PS: You sure are descriptive when it comes to this “attitude” you mention you sensed when in fact, I can wager, it didn’t even cross anyone’s minds here. Sounds like some sort of complex…but oh well. Peace!

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 1:58 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Eh

The attitude I picked up on was probably just everyone being defensive. After re-reading the thread, I definitely understand why people here are defensive. Some of the Nuggets fans have been giving us a bad interbutts name ( q_q ), which is why I’ve tried to stay mostly out of it. Anyone sees I’m a Nuggets fan and clearly I’m a deranged homer. Gotta try to rise above the rep, so to speak. After having spent most of another insomnia-filled evening browsing the archives here, I like the place. Good writing, passionate fans, but not so popular as to invite a large number of crazies into the mix. On that note, I’ll go back to Google Image Searching Dictionary.com’s Words of the Day.

If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding! HOW can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?!

by SlamDunkTheFunk on May 11, 2009 2:11 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that's really funny

that we are bringing up 1990’s NBA teams in a “my dick is bigger” contest. So lame.

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Again missing the point entirely.

I give up.

If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding! HOW can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?!

by SlamDunkTheFunk on May 11, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What is exactly is the point then?
I know the Mavs have been pretty solid for about a decade or so, but honestly, have you guys forgotten how shitty you were for the a long time? I know everyone around here is upset, and some of the Nuggets fans coming over here haven’t helped by being assholes, but this attitude you guys have taken on is kind of ridiculous.

Have you guys forgotten when you won a combined 25 games in two seasons in the early 90s? Just ten short seasons ago you guys won 19 games.

What the hell is the point of that? To prove you know your NBA history or are able to look up stuff on Wikipedia?

and LOL at this:

Did you ever imagine you’d be sitting here a decade later and popping off like you’re one of the kings of the game even though you’re still without a title (and I DO agree you guys got royally screwed in ’06)?

I skipped over that the first time….funny. Nobody around here thinks we are the kings of the NBA. We just think we got royally screwed by the refs — and this isn’t even the most painful time it has happened.

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Are you just trying to prove their point about Nuggets fans?

You’re making Nuggets fans look really, really bad.

GO BRONCOS!!!

by UnarmingMermaid on May 11, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yay for the good cop/bad cop routine

"He will not coddle them. Nolan Ryan doesn’t coddle." - Jeff Passan

by Dirk Diggler on May 11, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There are 2 types of intentional fouls

There’s the one where you hold the guy and stop the play.

And then there’s the gambler’s choice: you run up on the ballhandler and make a hard slap for the ball. In this case a few things can happen: One, they call the foul, as you may have wanted. Two, you slap the ball out and they don’t call the foul — even better. And three, you don’t slap the ball out, they don’t call the foul, and the guy goes on to drill a three and win the game. Wright took a gamble and lost. He also forgot the oldest rule in sports: you don’t stop playing till you hear the whistle. You can argue Wright kinda didn’t stop playing as he raised his arms to be sure he didn’t get called fouling on the shot. But he still should have contested Melo’s jumper.

Did the ref even know that Dallas had a foul to give? (is it the scorer table’s job to track that?) As a guess, I think the ref had a brain lapse and thought he’d be sending Melo to the line with a chance to tie the game over a hard bump in the backcourt. He was probably as nervous and confused as Wright, and he swallowed his whistle, as refs tend to do in the closing seconds of close games. He blew the call. But Wright, c’mon man, it’s the playoffs. Don’t leave anything to chance. You never know what you’ll get from a ref in that situation. As this post said, Wright deserves a bit of the blame.

I feel for Mavs fans. The ref blew a call that their strategy depended on. It was a truly soul crushing way to lose a game Dallas fought hard to win and probably deserved. But as Denver did, you play the ball, not the refs. Denver stole this one — to their credit. (and yea, I’m a Nuggets fan)

by DHinNYC on May 10, 2009 6:18 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree with just about everything you said

I think when Wright backed off like he did, he was making sure that he A. didn’t hit him hard enough to get a flagrant, and B. wasn’t caught fouling in the act of shooting.

Now, hindsight is 20/20 and all that, but they way Wright fouled him was at least defensible, even if it wasn’t the most effective. I think part of this falls on Carlisle, too, for not making sure the refs were looking for the foul to give.

Again though… this is all kind of like blaming the victim. The ref still should’ve made the call.

The NBA: Where Wunderlich Happens.

by MeanMr.Mustard on May 10, 2009 6:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wright and Carlisle deserve part of the blame.

I’m a Thuggets fan so take this with a grain of salt.
My first thought (as a Nuggets fan) was that this was a shitty way to win. I enjoyed the dominance of winning games by 22.2 points and a controversial win like this looks bad for everyone. My second thought was, hey, a win is a win.
I made a post on a different thread here right after the game. I acknowledged that the ref blew the call, but stated that the call didn’t decide the game. The game was not entirely composed of the last 6 seconds of play.
The ref missed the call, we can’t change that. We’ll never know if Melo (or Chauncey or JR) would have hit the game winning 3 had the foul counted. I think most Denver fans (and not just the fair-weather fans) have made comments as to WHY the foul wasn’t called, not whether the foul should have been called or not.
Wright lifts his arms, he went for the ball, that same contact hadn’t been called earlier, etc.
I agree that Wright lifted his arms so that Carmelo wouldn’t get 3 free throws. I agree that the call should have been made. I agree that the Nuggets would win the series anyways. I agree that Dahntay’s dunk on Dampier should have been an and1.
There are a ton of things that could have gone differently. They didn’t. Support your team in game 4 and move on.

by NuggBuckets on May 11, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed.

It’s not Carlisle’s job to tell the refs his strategy. Guy’s got enough on his plate. But in these games, as fouling was clearly his plan, it couldn’t hurt and probably should have been done. But damn. The announcers recognized what he was trying to do, why didn’t the ref?

This is one of those games that will change the way coaches communicate with the refs forever, at least for Carlisle.

Sigh. Another NBA playoffs, another “official” NBA apology. Another way in which coaches must adjust to wacky officiating.

by DHinNYC on May 10, 2009 6:55 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Why didn't the refs?

The announcers know because they sit next to the stat guys and watch the screen as the timeouts left and fouls to give comes up on the screen. The refs don’t have that luxury.
And the league offices are morons.

by NuggBuckets on May 11, 2009 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fantastic ...

They need to make a: Where crap officiating will happen?

by hugommorais on May 10, 2009 9:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The sad thing about all this ...

Is that the only way the mavs can win a title is having a team that can cruise through the playoffs winning by 10+ everytime … If we are close at the end of games, the clutch refs will always come to fuck us …

by hugommorais on May 10, 2009 9:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Good post Wes

All in all, a sober assessment of things.

And I do feel sorry for Dallas from the 06 Finals.

by KC Gunner on May 10, 2009 10:20 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I'm sorry, this is way off topic, but since I can't curse in my other blog home...

I just want to say fuck Big Baby and the Celtics…argh, I’m so frustrated! What a shitty weekend, basketball-wise…not sure how much more I can take with these heartbreaking games :(

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 10, 2009 11:57 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

the Mavs last night and the Magic tonight

I’m surprised you’re still alive. lol

No seriously, I feel your pain. I hate that guy so much.

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I was at the game

I barely have a voice and I was so bummed out after that shot. At least the Boston fans weren’t rubbing it in (and there were a surprising amount of them…the “Let’s go, Celtics!” chant was pretty audible throughout the arena);

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 11, 2009 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I knew you were in the game

when Big Baby (I hate this name so much) hit that shot, I was like “oh crap, Marie just shed tears of blood!” I’m sorry, but hey at least there wasn’t a referee screw up before he hit that shot. ;)

(Getting that reference in there before a Nugget fan replies in unprovoked anger. Kidding!)

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

After he hit that shot, I kind of just stood there like a dumbass, staring at the red light on the backboard

As the Celtics celebrated and the Magic were stunned. He was making those shots all night…and it wasn’t Rashard’s fault that he left to double Pierce. The Magic were horrible from the field, missing open shots that they would normally make. Redick was a black hole on offense and wasted valuable minutes in the 4th.

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 11, 2009 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What I found most sickening

was the way Big Baby knocked around that poor kid sitting courtside. What a punk.

But hey, I think the Magic still have a pretty good chance of taking out the Celtics, and if they don’t, then I am positive Cleveland will. Probably in 4, maybe 5, games.

by KC Gunner on May 11, 2009 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought

the guy in the LeBron jersey cheering like crazy for the Celtic win might have been more annoying than Big Baby.

draft dejuan blair

by Cablinasian on May 11, 2009 12:44 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

seriously, he has quite the mid-range shot

I hate him, but I wish Bass can pull the trigger like that.

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 12:20 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Big Baby

He used to be called Baby Shaq. Then the real Shaq’s lawyers weighed in. This Big Baby thing was just made up by the league — like Boobie Gibson.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on May 11, 2009 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There's too much bickering and going back and forth in here

To use a tired phrase, can’t we all just get along? I assume we’re all adults here. There’s simply no reason for opposing fans to come in here and attack us when we’re down, just like we shouldn’t call people bad names when we don’t know them personally (which I am guilty of, by the way, but that’s what happens when I’m provoked).

Please, let’s just focus on the basketball and act like civilized people.

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 11, 2009 12:04 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

people call other people names all the time in real life

Doesn’t make it right, but bringing it up on the internet (oh noes!) and lecturing other people who do it, when some take the the time to compose themselves and not be a slave to sheer emotion, just reeks of false self—righteousness. I am a sinner and I’m sorry for calling people names, there. ;)

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I call people names too...I'm sure everyone does

But this blog is a cool place to hang out during games and I’m sure we don’t want that atmosphere ruined because we’re all attacking each other. I mean, calling that Chandler fan who came in here a turf toe son of a bitch (among other things) is not one of my proudest moments.

Anyway…sorry for the self-righteousness or whatever…I don’t mean to be all preachy :)

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

by Marie on May 11, 2009 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you did? haha

Oh that statement wasn’t directed at you. Overall, I’m just fed up with these internet holier-than-thou posters who call out others who call people names. It’s the internet! You take it too seriously, you lose. Geez, 3rd graders do it better…

by ptrck on May 11, 2009 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

good news i didnt kill myself

fuck the nba

that is all

"Daryl (Morey, the Rockets general manager) and I were talking this morning. We both discussed how great Tracy is in the playoffs. There's very few people who have the ability to step up their games in the playoffs and he does. So we're not looking to run away from Tracy." - Houston Rockets Owner, Leslie Alexander

muhahahaha WTF?!?!

by zkmavz on May 11, 2009 10:18 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

frustrating

i feel as if over the past few years the mavs have had calls and non-calls not go their way more than any other team. yes, i don’t want to have to rely on the zebras to help us win, but i also don’t want them to help the other team win. i realize refs are human and they’re prone to mistakes but its just frustrating to see how more often than not the calls or missed calls work against the mavs. its also frustrating because other fans see us as whiners and what can we really do or say about that when games aren’t as fair as they should be.

also, overall i feel this playoffs in general have been poorly officiated. k-mart only got a technical for blatantly shoving dirk, which got turned into a flagrant 1 AFTER the game. Artest’s flagrant 2 which got changed to a flagrant 1 AFTER the game. Kobe thew an elbow at Artest and nothing happened. Rondo could have been called for a flagrant on Brad Miller and could have been thrown out for throwing Kirk Hinrich. The non-call on Antoine Wright’s intentional foul. the list goes on…

by garamji on May 11, 2009 10:48 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

Officiating has been terrible and will continue to be terrible. I agree that K-Mart deserved a flagrant 1. Rondo should have 4 points already against him. Artset should have stayed in both games he was ejected from. The list goes on and on. I hate when the Nuggets get called for every touch foul yet Melo gets hacked every time he drives to the rim and doesn’t get the call. That said, I feel for the other team every time the Nuggets foul and aren’t called for it. I wish that the game could be decided on skill alone but that’s not the case. Especially when you have chronic floppers like Manu and Varejao. But they’re bred to do that because the refs won’t call it if they don’t see it.

by NuggBuckets on May 11, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Refs

The calls are also wildly inconsistent from ref to ref. There is nothing like a standard for an offensive foul or traveling. Half of them are little Hitlers out to ‘keep control’ of the game. The others just want to please the league office. We need a Congressional hearing.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on May 11, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

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