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Around SBN: Terry Collins, David Wright, And The Mets/Brewers Kerfuffle

New Player Profiles: Vince Carter

Despite the fact that Lamar Odom clearly ranks as the offseason’s biggest pickup for the Mavericks, Vince Carter will always have a place in our sports memory that L’Odom never could. VC, believe it or not, is just two years older than the 32-year old Odom. He scored as many points as Odom did last year, and had a very respectable 14.89 PER (to Odom’s, as we’ve discussed unusual for him, 19.5).

Especially given the price, all indications point to Carter being a low-risk, high-reward proposition for the Mavs.

Star-divide

Carter is a 6’6" shooting guard who not too long ago was a basketball must-see. In his Half-Man, Half-Amazing days, he did things in mid-air that you and I have a hard time doing standing in a pool. When he recently said that all that dunking stuff was "overrated", it broke my heart a little bit, not because I imagined for a minute that the dude was going to be doing any of it in Dallas, but if he didn’t ENJOY it, what was the dang point?

But I digress. The Mavs are certainly not getting that Vince Carter. It is in fact, not clear what they’re getting. After he was traded to Phoenix last year, he shot a terrible 42.2% and started fouling every one as a defender. Because it’s Vince on the one hand, and because he’s approaching his mid-30s on the other hand, it is impossible to know what part of that is decline, and what part of that is having been traded from a contender to a never-was.

Here’s the thing, though. Steve Novak and Peja Stojakovic may shoot a basketball from distance at about equal levels of ability—but Peja, because he’s Peja, has done it against the best defenses, in the toughest atmosphere, as the focal point of the offense and as a devastating secondary weapon. For years.

Being an All-Star is not just about what you can do, physically. Other than VC’s strength, it’s not clear that Gerald Green, for example, couldn’t physically perform all the high-flying stunts that Carter performed. Carter, like Peja, is smart. He’s been there before, a lot of times before. He knows where to be with the ball, and where to pass the ball.

Carter, unlike many older players, has not had to develop a three-point shot as he got older, because he already had it. He’s a lifetime .374 shooter, and shot .366 with Phoenix last year, .367 with Orlando the year before and .385 with the Nets the year before. Given the set-up of the Mavs offense that, more than anything, is probably what inspired this pickup.

I expect for him a more productive version of what I expect from his cousin, Tracy McGrady, with the Hawks, an even greater player who has fallen on ever harder times. I expect him to play a big role in making the right offensive plays and taking advantage of the opportunities afforded him by the fact that he has never played with this much talent before.

When swinging it around the perimeter, Carter adds to the Mavs coterie of wing players with a three-point shot, an essential part of the Mavericks offense. He’s still capable of taking the ball inside, and what he can’t achieve by lift and power, he can still achieve to a certain degree by a lot of experience finding a way to take his guy to the hoop. He’s never scored lower than the 14 points he scored last year, and never had a lower TS% than last year’s 52.8%. But he’s still an effective scorer, and if he chooses his spots wisely (a luxury perhaps never afforded him before in his career), he could fit right in, on a team that doesn’t need him to do too much.

Carter is likely to see nearly all of his minutes at the two, and it’s possible that they’ll be limited minutes. He’s already sat out a practice or two with knee tendinitis, he is 34, and he is not a great defender. The Odom signing is also likely to cut in to his minutes, as the Mavs have Roddy Beaubois and Jason Terry as guards that should not often be playing the one, and Delonte West who will play both. It’s unclear, as yet, whether Dominique Jones will be able to work his way into minutes, though these would also likely come at the two.

Having said that, Carter may see some minutes at the three, when the Mavericks go small. If they decide to stick with their occasional three-guard lineup, without Barea, Carter is very likely to be the third guard, given his size. Also, with only one true SF on the roster (Marion) and one who’s likely to see most of his minutes there (Odom) but who is technically a PF, in smaller lineups in general VC may slot over to the three. These lineups might look something like Dirk, Odom, Carter, Terry, Kidd or Dirk, Odom, Marion, Terry, Kidd (or with either of the guards replaced by West and Beaubois).

Ultimately, the Mavs probably picked Carter up because of his intelligence and three-point shooting, but also the fact that they’ve had a lot of success with late-career veterans who have everything but a ring. With Vince, it’s all going to be about whether he’s willing to do what the Mavericks ask of him and not more. He’s never been this far down on the scoring totem pole and like Shawn Marion before him, it may require some discussion.

Count on the Mavericks culture, as well as their recent obvious success (championships help a lot of arguments) to convince Carter that if everybody toes the line, everybody can get what they deserve. If Shawn Marion, Jason Kidd, Peja Stojakovic and Caron Butler could learn to become role players (although obviously, three of them especially with very LARGE roles), count on Carter to be able to, too. If he buys into the Mavs culture enough to pick his spots, and learns the system, it’s reasonable to expect a Caron-like contribution from Carter this year, at least on offense.

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Low risk, high reward types

are my favorite signings.

I live to play the devil's advocate.

by AfterSchoolSpecial on Dec 16, 2011 12:58 PM CST reply actions  

Knowing Vince for years, and being one of his greatest fans, I can tell you this

If the Mavs (Kidd) can keep him involved mentally in the game, you’ll have a great player. If not, then you’ll have a mediocre player.

The way you’re going to keep him in the game is by giving him the ball to create in the half court offense. Kidd was a genius with this in New Jersey as he was mainly a fast break point guard, while in the half court offense Kidd would just drive the ball up and give it to Vince to initiate the offense. When Vince gets on fire he’s hard to stop and he gives a much better effort defensively because he gets engaged and he’s such a good passer and so UNSELFISH (despite of what the media will make you believe).

In Orlando and Phoenix things didn’t work because Jameer is a SG in the body of a PG that never gave VC the chance to create stuff and Nash is a dribble dribble dribble pick and roll with a big man – pass it to the big man kind of point guard – same thing – never game Vince the ball unless as a spot-up shooter or sometimes in the post (where Vince is pretty good).

But especially in Orlando, it amazed me how they failed to see so many matchup problems Vince was doing to the other teams. Never gave him the ball, they were just about passing to Dwight and move everybody else aside. Very few pick and rolls.

I remember a game vs the Jazz when Vince was matched up against Gordon Hayward and was killing Hayward. He scored like 2 or 3 consecutive baskets then Nelson, in his wisdom, decided to stop passing the ball to him.

So, again – for Vince to be great he needs the ball – not to shoot it, but create stuff with it. The 1-2 pick and roll with Kidd and Vince or the 2-4 pick and pop with Vince and Dirk should work really well if they decide to use them.

I just hope to (and I believe I will) see Kidd give VC the ball to create in the half court offense.

by Raptorel on Dec 16, 2011 1:11 PM CST reply actions  

Sounds great, and thanks for the insight.

by andytobo on Dec 16, 2011 1:40 PM CST up reply actions  

you used 'coterie' in a post

just in case you forgot.

Managing Editor of MavsMoneyball.com

by LJRotter on Dec 16, 2011 1:43 PM CST up reply actions  

As far as negative things go

Vince is way too friendly with everybody (I’m talking about the other team).

One time he set a pick that sent Stephen Curry to the ground, and instead of running on the fast break, Vince actually stopped and helped Curry up! I mean wow :))

He’s very slow right now as well and doesn’t get to the free throw line. Sometimes he can shoot his team out by missing and missing and keeping on shooting but I don’t think that’d be the case with the Mavs as he’ll get replaced if that happens.

He also has times when he’s really passive on defense, sometimes just “watching” people rebound and defend. That happens when he’s not involved offensively because, like I said, when he’s involved offensively he’ll also give effort on defense. He was always like this.

by Raptorel on Dec 16, 2011 2:00 PM CST reply actions  

....

not even close to that

by capz1990 on Dec 17, 2011 12:20 PM CST up reply actions  

He can that

but at his age, he might need 20 shots lol. Double digits and FG% close to 50% is all I want from VC.

Dwight or Bust
Nets lose 33+ games this season.

by Shameer1016 on Dec 17, 2011 9:22 PM CST up reply actions  

Yeah exactly

It’s not that he can’t do it but you got to get him in a rhythm and you never know how many shots (missed) it will take to get him there.

Realistically, for ~24 mpg or so, he’ll average about 10 ppg with 2 rpg and 3 apg.

by Raptorel on Dec 18, 2011 5:18 AM CST up reply actions  

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